Thoughts on an "active PCT"?  

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Fluffy
(@fluffy)
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27/10/2018 5:26 pm  

Interesting, and btw. jboldman, that's not MY setup, heh, it's ceosm from SynergyMuscle.

And as it seems like atm., people are doubting it


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Black Baccara
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27/10/2018 9:58 pm  
Posted by: jboldman
there are coonflicting studies then since this is a graph of blood levels after 140mg of test enanthate was injected. The x axis is physiologic level, you can see that it takes 10 days to reach physiologic levels.


In hypogonadal men ?

@Fluffy

I am interesting by your graph.
Schering has put on the market a new product called Nebido, they claim that you only need to inject it every 3 months to obtain physiological levels of T. If it's true that's mean that we can greatly influence the esterefied steroids pharmacokinetic by injecting big amount, here 1000mg T undecanoate. In some studies I have read, with low amounts, the answer (T level) was proportionnal to the injected dose, with little to no change in the drug half life. About TRT, a lot of doctors are not very convicted by the injection route.


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jboldman
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27/10/2018 10:31 pm  

i have been a fan of test undecanoate for soem time. there are many studies that support its use.

The pharmokinetics of test woudl be the same for hypo men as eugondal men, the base line would just be diffrerent. once blood levels are stable the half life is the same.

jb


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Seabiscuit Hogg
(@seabiscuit-hogg)
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27/10/2018 11:20 pm  
Posted by: jboldman
i have been a fan of test undecanoate for soem time. there are many studies that support its use.

jb

It has to be injectable though. Oral TU has proven to be ineffective in most ppl.

Seabiscuit Hogg is a fictious internet character. It is not recommended that you receive medical advice from fictious internet characters.

SBH :)


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jboldman
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27/10/2018 11:54 pm  

correct. For bb'ing uses, injectable is the way to go, i keep it around for vacations and extended abscences when taking gear along would be a hassle.

jb


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Fluffy
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28/10/2018 12:52 am  

*bump*


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Seabiscuit Hogg
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28/10/2018 1:34 am  
Posted by: Black Baccara
In hypogonadal men ?

@Fluffy

I am interesting by your graph.
Schering has put on the market a new product called Nebido, they claim that you only need to inject it every 3 months to obtain physiological levels of T. If it's true that's mean that we can greatly influence the esterefied steroids pharmacokinetic by injecting big amount, here 1000mg T undecanoate. In some studies I have read, with low amounts, the answer (T level) was proportionnal to the injected dose, with little to no change in the drug half life. About TRT, a lot of doctors are not very convicted by the injection route.

Do you if there is some other mechanism to sustain release with Nebido? The half life of TU isn't anywhere near that long and even a 4 ml depot wouldn't sustain it for three months.

Seabiscuit Hogg is a fictious internet character. It is not recommended that you receive medical advice from fictious internet characters.

SBH :)


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Black Baccara
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28/10/2018 1:33 am  

Schering has said only TU 4ml/1000mg ... i'm like you : a little dubious


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USPLabs
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28/10/2018 2:32 am  

haha

Posted by: Wicked Design
Man this stinks so bad you would think Cy Willson wrote it.

This is strictly based on Cy wilson protocol. Cy wilson and I are friends. The boy will soon have a PHD in pharmacology. The Protocol goes against conventional wisdom so it's common to attack NEW idea even.

He compaired data from studies to reach the conclusion. He did not theorize it out of thin air. I have use steroids for over 5 years, and always experienced the related crash post cycle until I used his protocol. I retain a sex drive, maintain all gains, and transition into my supplement cycle smoothly. I speak from experience and love the protocol and respect the source of theorized it.

This protocol can be used without camphibolic. The credibility of the protocol may have be slightly skewed by the introduction of camphibolic. I fully understand the point of view of the doudting customers. Please read the camphibolic series at synegymuscle.com, and you will be inclined to include camphibolic in your traditional PCT.

As a community, I seen BB binge drink, smake weed, snort coke, use X, and experiement with HUGE amounts of HGH, GRAMS and garms of steroids a week, Insulin use, year round cycles and the list evolves.

Injecting another 150mg of Testosterone Enanthate with clomid to test a NEW PCT regimen is harmless and really it will not kill you. I tried it and was skeptical, but I will not conclude a cycle without this protocol again.

Love it or hate it, the protocol is at your finger tips so trash it or buy it.

take care
ceosm

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Black Baccara
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28/10/2018 3:23 am  
Posted by: Seabiscuit Hogg
Do you if there is some other mechanism to sustain release with Nebido? The half life of TU isn't anywhere near that long and even a 4 ml depot wouldn't sustain it for three months.

No it's definitively only TU in 4ml castor oil, long ester side chain & injection volume are the keys for TRT.

the Minto was the first step :"Thus, the bioavailability and physiological effects of a nandrolone ester in an oil vehicle are greatest when the ester is injected in a small (1 ml vs. 4 ml) volume and into the gluteal vs. deltoid muscle"

(here bioavailability definition is not the total area under the curve but the Cmax and the time needed to obtain it).

But for doping use, Cmax and supraphysiological T levels are more important :
in regard of the PK/PD relation (if PD is anabolism), TE could be the best choice :

Injectable testosterone undecanoate has more favourable pharmacokinetics and pharmacodynamics than testosterone enanthate.
CJ Partsch, GF Weinbauer, R Fang, and E Nieschlag
Institute of Reproductive Medicine of the University, Munster, Germany :

"During the last month of the study a significantly higher increase in body weight was seen in the TE than in the TU group. It may be speculated than the extremely high T levels during the first week after TE injection had a more profound anabolic effect than the moderately elevated T levels after TU injection."

But to give a definitive answer, body composition must be checked because water retention could have played a role in the body weight increase :
" In contrast, TE injection resulted in a rapid increase of oestradiol levels ..."


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Seabiscuit Hogg
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28/10/2018 4:10 am  

That's interesting. I would have assumed that TU would aromatize more readily.

Seabiscuit Hogg is a fictious internet character. It is not recommended that you receive medical advice from fictious internet characters.

SBH :)


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Seabiscuit Hogg
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28/10/2018 5:04 am  

ceosm- The camphibolic looks like something I'll probably try. My skeptcism was about using TE during pct. You're right, it's probably not going to hurt anybody but it's not really pct if you don't come off. I prefer the idea of using Clomid or nolva during the last two wks of a cycle without tapering dosages.

Seabiscuit Hogg is a fictious internet character. It is not recommended that you receive medical advice from fictious internet characters.

SBH :)


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Black Baccara
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28/10/2018 5:55 am  
Posted by: Seabiscuit Hogg
That's interesting. I would have assumed that TU would aromatize more readily.

Why ??


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Seabiscuit Hogg
(@seabiscuit-hogg)
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28/10/2018 6:26 am  
Posted by: Black Baccara
Why ??

Just based on the fact that I retain water more with TU than TE.

Seabiscuit Hogg is a fictious internet character. It is not recommended that you receive medical advice from fictious internet characters.

SBH :)


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USPLabs
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21/11/2018 6:22 am  
Posted by: Seabiscuit Hogg
ceosm- The camphibolic looks like something I'll probably try. My skeptcism was about using TE during pct. You're right, it's probably not going to hurt anybody but it's not really pct if you don't come off. I prefer the idea of using clomid or nolva during the last two wks of a cycle without tapering dosages.

theory is with test e at la ow dose along with Clomid will allow natural rebound of testosterone. which is frowned upon. I have no problems taking the bashing.

I have used Clomid stand alone for PCT, and I have lost gains, moods changes, sex drive is gone, and mild depression in the first 2 weeks of PCT. I not to mention PCT related acne on my back.

Since switching to the TEst E/Clomid protocol along with my common place supplements. I retain weight and may even gain 1 or 2lbs; I avoid depression; I avoid loss of libido; I avoid back acne. Point being even if I am on, This NEW theory protocol, or as we use to call it tapering works wonders for my recovery and its a nice transition into a supplement cycle. This could be called tapering with Clomid.

The skeptics should give it a try...I did.

ceosm

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