OK, here goes my diet again

ok, 6' 223lbs down to 220. the tanita says 19% but hopefully that is not the case. I am falling back on my oatmeal diet, tried and true. I eat a reasonable meal in the evening low on carbs, and three other meals a day basically oatmeal/ protein powder and sometimes some raisins if i need a boost. luecine and bcaa's prior and post workout. workouts 5 days a week, single body part. working up to the cardio.

naturally i take a fistfull of supps. Test and masteron.

jb

well i think i weigh a tad more than you sonic. but i would say that is the right proportion. if you want to maintain the healthy aspects of the meal and reduce the glycemic number add a tablespoon of flax oil to it. serving size is really dertermined ultimately by the scale.

jb

Posted by: jboldman

ok, 6' 223lbs down to 220. the tanita says 19% but hopefully that is not the case. I am falling back on my oatmeal diet, tried and true. I eat a reasonable meal in the evening low on carbs, and three other meals a day basically oatmeal/ protein powder and sometimes some raisins if i need a boost.

jb

How much oatmeal and protein powder in each meal? I like that combo as well, but I find I have to limit the servings because it ends up high glycemic and I get hungry quickly and get carb cravings.

I use 1/4 cup non-instant oatmeal and 1 serving of protein powder (22g protein and 1.6 g carbs) as a meal. Maybe that's too small?

I would love to use a similar diet because of the simplicity, but the sweet cravings it generates kills me.

My philosophies on dieting are quite different than most other people.
I agree that lower GI carbs are preferred over the higher ones.
I feel that grazing beats larger longer spaced out meals.

I completely feel that keeping insulin in check is one of the goal�s when trying to lose bodyfat.

Not going to turn this into any kind of debate but I do like the idea of higher fiber in the diet. For instance 35 grams burns 250 calories, fiber lowers the Glycemic Load of the meal.

I also feel that using different foods for all your macro�s will give you a more balanced diet.
I am of the lower carb higher persuasion and higher protein and higher fat. I find this for ME to be more effective, I crave less food, it keeps my energy up due to no spiking of insulin, and I feel better.
But this has its own set of drawbacks, like constipation among one of them.

I am not a big fan of cardio for weight loss, although I do agree it is healthy but in my opinion diet is the most important (of course resistance training too).
Once the diet is nailed most things will just fall into place.
If the diet stalls then add in the cardio.

I usually keep my carbs to fibrous ones like fruits and vegetables. I swear any bread I eat tends to make me bloated and then I go crazy with cravings for carbs.

Although most don�t agree with this next statement for controversial sake I do feel it works well to turn from being a sugar burner to a fat burner for fuel. Rob Faigin has a fun reading book on this.

Although I agree with the calorie in vs. calorie out I think tweaking the macro�s around offers better fat loss.

Anyway, I know nobody asked but just thought id toss some of my feelings out there about dieting, for me this seems to work best.

I'm In! Actually I started Oct 1. Starting weight 238 6'4" as of Nov. 1 227.5. Here is my diet and workout plan.

Meal 1 smoothie 1 1/2 scoop protien, 3 tbls plain yogurt, 1 tbls nat. peanut butter, 1/3 cup nuked oatmeal, 6 ice cubes

Meal 2: 2 slices of cheese, 1 cup carrots, 1 cup raw broccoli

Meal 3: turkey sandwich on whole grain bread

Meal 4: postworkout Smoothie (same as above)

Meal 5: 2 eggs, 4 slices turkey bacon and an apple

Meal 6: smoothie (same as above)

Workout
Full body 3 days aweek M,W,F
Cardio on off days intervals on treadmill 1 min at 6 mph 1 min at 10 mph repeat 5 times with a cool down walk for 10 minutes.

I realize the food sounds like alot. But this diet works for me.

sw 223 cw 220 twl 3lbs

i almost forgot natty peanut butter. sonic, try adding a tablespoon of natty pb to that oatmeal and it will stand by you.

i find that for me, cardio is the crowning jewel of losing weight, i have NEVER been able to lose substantial weight by diet alone. NOt saying it can not be done but I can not do it. I like to eat a lot and cardio allows me more calories intake while helping me to refine my fat burning. i also think that for most bodybuilders cardio is absolutely essential for cv health. what good does it do you to be ripped and and not be able to walk a flight of stairs without being out of breath. I am a hiker and a backpacker and i have to maintain my cvh to continue particularly at my age.

jb

Posted by: jboldman

sw 223 cw 220 twl 3lbs

i almost forgot natty peanut butter. sonic, try adding a tablespoon of natty pb to that oatmeal and it will stand by you.

i find that for me, cardio is the crowning jewel of losing weight, i have NEVER been able to lose substantial weight by diet alone. NOt saying it can not be done but I can not do it. I like to eat a lot and cardio allows me more calories intake while helping me to refine my fat burning. i also think that for most bodybuilders cardio is absolutely essential for cv health. what good does it do you to be ripped and and not be able to walk a flight of stairs without being out of breath. I am a hiker and a backpacker and i have to maintain my cvh to continue particularly at my age.

jb

Bet you are a younger man than me....Im 47.....

Why do the extra cardio when you cheat on your diet?

I never suggested nor said cardio is not healthfull or beneficial but too many think cardio is the end all of all.
This I actually have a problem with.

I think diets are quite personal.

But blending food raises the GI or GL of that meal.
Why choose carrots over green beans? Or asparagus?

If you think about it, sustained blood sugars without a crash would be best for energy stability.

I don't see bread in the dieter's arsenol.
For "ME" this is not an option.

I am not suggesting not doing cardio but I am suggesting if you don't have your diet in order doing cardio to counteract poor diet is counterproductive.

Why not use diet to favor health and fat loss?
A gallon of ice water burns an extra 150 calories..
Fiber slows GI and takes cal's to burn that.
Why not take advantage of this?

Not making this a debate really unless those in power wish to and at this point I would welcome this.

It is common knowledge that resistance training is superior for fat loss than cardio.

Again its what you are looking for.

Not steppin on my bro's toe's, I would love to hear all arguements in this matter.

This would be good for the board anyway.
Good to let the knowledge fly.
It's all good guy's.

Posted by: jboldman

sw 223 cw 220 twl 3lbs

i almost forgot natty peanut butter. sonic, try adding a tablespoon of natty pb to that oatmeal and it will stand by you.

i find that for me, cardio is the crowning jewel of losing weight, i have NEVER been able to lose substantial weight by diet alone. NOt saying it can not be done but I can not do it. I like to eat a lot and cardio allows me more calories intake while helping me to refine my fat burning. i also think that for most bodybuilders cardio is absolutely essential for cv health. what good does it do you to be ripped and and not be able to walk a flight of stairs without being out of breath. I am a hiker and a backpacker and i have to maintain my cvh to continue particularly at my age.

jb

Thanks, I'll try the pb- I also often forget that flax oil is tasty in oatmeal, and in addition to adding omegas it also lowers the GI.

I'm like you too, I need to do cardio to lose weight, but right now I can't do cardio because of a foot injury. Swimming is all I have and I'm not particularly thrilled by it. And I travel for a living, which doesn't help.

That's why the oatmeal + protein powder is so appealing, since I can store it in my hotel room without refrigeration and extensive preparation.

Thanks for the advice, I'll try it.

Fish oils for Omega 3's over flax.
Better profile.

223 219 4

have you ever tasted liquid fish oil? perhaps if you took enough gel caps it would change the GI....

hackskii, i do not think that we are argueing here since it sounds like you think cardio is a good idea. nor am i saying that resistance training is not a good fat burner. i think you would agree that resistance training PLUS cardio would result in greater fat loss AND improved CVH, definitely a win win for all. I am not advocating cheating on your diet just eating more good stuff. It improves my ability to take in adequate amounts of protein and fiber without harming my diet. You sound like a nelson montana fan!
We do not censor threads here unless someone goes over the top and/or becomes offensive. we like to think we are all working toward the same goals. As many have pointed out, losing weight is a very personal thing and imo, the key is finding what works for you and proceeding accordingly.

jb

Cut about 500 kcal a day and add low intensity cardio 2 times a day, after your AM strength training workout and at 6:00 PM again.

orig. posted by hackskii
Oh, I do agree with you but tweaking the diet is the easiest thing to do.
perhaps for you but not necessarily for others

I have heard of Neslon Montana but never read any of his stuff.

back in the old elite days, nelson and i used to discuss this very subject and he, like you, believed that diet and weight training was the best way to lose weight

But, using the blender to process your food raises the GI of the food.
Just like ground beef would in theory raise the GI of the food of lets say steak.
Because of the chewing and breaking down of the food would require additional calories.

Also carrots are pretty high in the glycemic index so something like green beans would offer the same kind of nutrition but lowering the GI of the food or the glycemic load of the food.

Doing something like eating just the skin of two apples compared to eating one whole apple will effect the GI of that meal as well.
All these little things make diets easier and more effective.

Like, one gallion of ice water burns 150 calories.

not sure how or if i should respond to this, i do not think i was talking about the glycemic index. You make good points although i am not sure i would give up a good lean steak for hamburg just to save a couple calories

The issue with cardio is kind of like this.
It will make the body more efficient, this is a good thing but, once the body is more efficient then what does this mean?
In a sense it runs more efficient requiring less fuel.

not as long as you continue to exercise! I have never consumed more calories than when i was doing daily cardio for an hour a day

My mail lady is thick and walks like 8 miles a day.
I asked her why she isnt thin (we are friends so I can ask her that), she said her body got used to it.
She went on a medical leave and was gone for like 6 months, when I saw her again she got pretty freaking big.
It took her a long time to come back down but never goes below that thick look

point please? your post lady keeps her weight problem in control with exercise to the point of only being 'thick" but without the exercise becomes "pretty freaking big"? Perhaps her diet might need a little fine tuning? i have a very good friend who ran five miles a day and was 245lbs. after his doc told him he was in grave danger due to high cholesterol as well as some other issues, he gave up the cinnamon rolls on the way to and from work, skipped the pizza at lunch, starting watching what he ate, so far he has lost 35 lbs and has dropped 6 inches off his weight. diet AND cardio.

Another friend of mine started running and it took him like 4-5 months but lost 45 pounds, just by running.
He had his bodyfat done and guess what?...........He was the same bodyfat just lighter.
He said he is stuck at a plateau.
Now that just sucks.
again looking for your point. even as you describe it, he has lost fat. my experience suggests that when losing large amounts of weight using cardio AND DIET the weight is primarily water and fat. This applies to reasonable healthy weight loss not fasting or other extreme methods. in all the cases that i have observed, as the weight loss increases the bf% decreases. Perhaps your friend should fine tune his diet as well. it worked for my friend.

I am a firm believer in doing it myself of losing 25 pounds and 6.5" on my waist while doing absolutly zero cardio.
Sure I lift 5 days a week but for every 4 pounds I lost an inch on my waist.
This really tells me something here.

what? that diet can be an effective way to lose fat and weight? no one is arguing that point.

Would I have lost more fat doing cardio?.............I dont think so.
you think that adding cardio to your diet would have resulted in no additional fat loss? or if you had not dieted and used cardio alone would you have lost as much? i think it goes without question that adding cardio to any diet plan would result in increased weight loss unless you increased your calories. I am not advocating cardio alone.
Would I have lost it faster doing cardio?..............Probably but then again I was losing around 2 pounds a week and I dont want to lose faster than that this will compromise lean muscle mass.

not necessarily. the amount of total weight loss in a week without loss of lean body mass depends on several variables including but not limited to starting weight, bf%, initial hydration, diet including protein and supplements. I might also add that since we are posting in a forum that has more than a passing interest in anabolics it might be reasonable to assume that some reading this forum and attempting to lose weight "might" be supplementing with anabolics and hgh. i would be one.

Or this can be thought of another way.
Sitting in front of the TV the body is burning fat and probably little if any carbohydrates.
When sprinting the body burns almost all carbs and little fat.
With the post workout fat loss factoring sure there will be fat loss.

perhaps you would care to post a study that supports the thesis that the body at rest preferentially burns fat. it would seem to fly in the face of almost everything i have read. there is an exellent write up wrt lipolysis here: i would skip to the paragraph on mobilization and metabolism of fat. one of the reasons i like low intensity cardio with a duration of over 20 minutes is that most studies suggest that this induces a preferential substrate metabolism that favors fat.

Or another way, long distance runners are notorius for having lower Testosterone levels than their weight lifting counterparts.

since we are talking about diet, cardio, and weight loss i am not sure why we care about the testosterone status of long distance runners. i am not advocating running the long distances necessary to see this condition although most long distance runners are very lean!

Again without stepping on anyones toes, I feel that diet is far superior to fat loss than any other thing.

no hard feelings here, if it worked for me i might advocate it as well, since it does not and since i am concerned about my cvh, diet AND cardio are a no brainer for me. All opinions within reason and theories are welcome here and discussions such as this provoke thought and critical thinking.

There was this chick in my gym that ran an hour on the treadmill and did an hour on the stairmaster. She did this 6 days a week and then played recquetball on the 7th day.
I asked her why she did so much cardio. Her responce was she could eat all the M&M;'s she wanted.
Her upper body was pretty lean but she had a big fat ass. I had nothing to say.

think how awesome she would have looked if she had a nutritious diet! I hope you are not comparing her to me? Although i do love peanut m&ms;, when i diet and do cardio i am able to increase my intake of high quality protein, high fiber carbohydrates, and healthy oils. In this way i believe that not only am i losing weight but also making sure that my body has a ready supply of a variety of nutritious foods essential for maintaining muscle mass while dieting.

Fish oils and monounsaturated oils will lower the GL of a meal.
I take 12 a day and rate fish oils probably tops on the list of my fav supplements. I take them for anti-inflammatory and cardiovascular health and to keep my ratio of Omega 3 to Omega 6 in better check.
There are some that feel taking in Omega 3's actually rev up the brown fat burning.

i could not agree with you more, i make sure that i consume plenty of fish oil caps during the day. i just do not favor using fish oil to reduce the GI of my oatmeal.

It is plain that we will never change each others minds but it is nice to talk about the subject as it is more than a trivial matter of interest for everyone here. when dieting and using cardio to lose fat one must be very serious about their approach. to really pull it off without sacrificing that precious lbm, you have to constantly fine tune all elements of your program. you certainly can accomplish these goals with diet and supplementation alone (of course using resistance exercise) although i and many others believe that it is not only easier to accomplish this using a combination of cardio and diet but is healthier as well. I used to say that bodybuilders that advocated diet only were just trying to excuse their laziness but have since met some serious bodybuilders that are of that opinion so i have revised my assessment (mostly )

jb

i feel and look younger however my actual age is somewhat over 60!

"Bet you are a younger man than me....Im 47....."

jb

Posted by: jboldman

223 219 4

have you ever tasted liquid fish oil? perhaps if you took enough gel caps it would change the GI....

hackskii, i do not think that we are argueing here since it sounds like you think cardio is a good idea. nor am i saying that resistance training is not a good fat burner. i think you would agree that resistance training PLUS cardio would result in greater fat loss AND improved CVH, definitely a win win for all. I am not advocating cheating on your diet just eating more good stuff. It improves my ability to take in adequate amounts of protein and fiber without harming my diet. You sound like a nelson montana fan!
We do not censor threads here unless someone goes over the top and/or becomes offensive. we like to think we are all working toward the same goals. As many have pointed out, losing weight is a very personal thing and imo, the key is finding what works for you and proceeding accordingly.

jb

Oh, I do agree with you but tweaking the diet is the easiest thing to do.

I have heard of Neslon Montana but never read any of his stuff.

But, using the blender to process your food raises the GI of the food.
Just like ground beef would in theory raise the GI of the food of lets say steak.
Because of the chewing and breaking down of the food would require additional calories.

Also carrots are pretty high in the glycemic index so something like green beans would offer the same kind of nutrition but lowering the GI of the food or the glycemic load of the food.

Doing something like eating just the skin of two apples compared to eating one whole apple will effect the GI of that meal as well.
All these little things make diets easier and more effective.

Like, one gallion of ice water burns 150 calories.

The issue with cardio is kind of like this.
It will make the body more efficient, this is a good thing but, once the body is more efficient then what does this mean?
In a sense it runs more efficient requiring less fuel.

My mail lady is thick and walks like 8 miles a day.
I asked her why she isnt thin (we are friends so I can ask her that), she said her body got used to it.
She went on a medical leave and was gone for like 6 months, when I saw her again she got pretty freaking big.
It took her a long time to come back down but never goes below that thick look

Another friend of mine started running and it took him like 4-5 months but lost 45 pounds, just by running.
He had his bodyfat done and guess what?...........He was the same bodyfat just lighter.
He said he is stuck at a plateau.
Now that just sucks.

I am a firm believer in doing it myself of losing 25 pounds and 6.5" on my waist while doing absolutly zero cardio.
Sure I lift 5 days a week but for every 4 pounds I lost an inch on my waist.
This really tells me something here.
Would I have lost more fat doing cardio?.............I dont think so.
Would I have lost it faster doing cardio?..............Probably but then again I was losing around 2 pounds a week and I dont want to lose faster than that this will compromise lean muscle mass.

Or this can be thought of another way.
Sitting in front of the TV the body is burning fat and probably little if any carbohydrates.
When sprinting the body burns almost all carbs and little fat.
With the post workout fat loss factoring sure there will be fat loss.

Or another way, long distance runners are notorius for having lower testosterone levels than their weight lifting counterparts.

Again without stepping on anyones toes, I feel that diet is far superior to fat loss than any other thing.

There was this chick in my gym that ran an hour on the treadmill and did an hour on the stairmaster. She did this 6 days a week and then played recquetball on the 7th day.
I asked her why she did so much cardio. Her responce was she could eat all the M&M;'s she wanted.
Her upper body was pretty lean but she had a big fat ass. I had nothing to say.

Fish oils and monounsaturated oils will lower the GL of a meal.
I take 12 a day and rate fish oils probably tops on the list of my fav supplements. I take them for anti-inflammatory and cardiovascular health and to keep my ratio of Omega 3 to Omega 6 in better check.
There are some that feel taking in Omega 3's actually rev up the brown fat burning.

Posted by: guijr

Cut about 500 kcal a day and add low intensity cardio 2 times a day, after your AM strength training workout and at 6:00 PM again.

Just out of curiosity, what do you consider low intensity cardio?

An answer in terms of heart rate + total time if you wouldn't mind... but a more general answer would be appreciated too.

I sometimes get in the mindset of "why bother" if I can't achieve a BPM of 145+ for an appreciable amount of time.